So generally the entire clothes industry is slavery ridden and completely fucked. Trying to follow the supply chain is basically impossible.
I would suggest essentially as little as possible for as long as possible, plant fibres probs good. synthetic not really that bad given the whole state of everything it’s small fries in terms of plastic waste.
get local tailors to make clothing if you can afford it
Wtf are you talking about? I’m not super rich, but i get some things done with a local tailor and one of the biggest reasons is to support local business and avoid overseas slave labour
You really don’t know what choices someone is making. If you replace clothing about once a decade and don’t own much it’s not very expensive.
High up front sure but maybe someone is eating cheap bean and rice based food, maybe they don’t buy alcohol, maybe they don’t own a car, maybe they buy used stuff rather than new whatever. There are loads of ways for many people to squirrel away the funds to get an item made here and there. Yeah obvs if you’re destitute it’s impossible and right now with economies going to shit way more people are losing money each week but prior there were choices people could usually make.
Yes it involves giving up other things and it can be stressful and difficult but that’s expected. Slavery makes things cheap in dollars and high in human misery.
That really is a ‘where you live’ thing. When I lived in SEA I could buy a button down shirt you could wear to work for about $5, going to a tailor and having one bespoke was $6 in cotton, or $15 in silk. Wool was actually more expensive since there was no domestic production.
Depends on where you live. In European cities it will be expensive to get new things tailored, but there will be shops only for changes and repairs, which will be cheaper, for example.
That really depends. If you buy a tshirt it was probably made paying someone like 5c a day.
If you find someone who makes clothing, just a normal arse person not someone catering to the rich, they can probably make a basic tshirt to your rough size in about 3 hours or so. If they’re paid a reasonable fee that’s going to be in my country for example 200 aud or so factoring in material. A sweat shop T would be 20 to 50, or even 80 in a high end store so it’s really not much more expensive.
Wear it till it has holes in it so say 5 to 10 years and it’s really not that expensive.
More complicated clothing gets more expensive but a basic wardrobe is something like 3 Ts, 3 long sleave tops, 2 heavy pants, 2 light pants/skirts etc. you don’t need to buy it all at once. Sometimes you need more clothes than that, e.g. you’re a woman and you work customer facing but most people have waaaaay more clothes than they need.
What are you doing where you can’t wear pants for a week or a top for 3 days?
Hard labour you don’t wear new clothes you wear your old tattered stuff and hand me downs/second hand etc, or toughened workwear.
It sounds like you want to find a reason to do nothing rather than do what you can. Like if you want to avoid enslaving others and animal cruelty your lifestyle will have to change because your lifestyle is based on exploitation. If you don’t want to change then get comfortable with slavery, idk what else to say.
Rather than shoot down things, why don’t you say how much time you’re willing to put into it and how much money? and what resources you have?
Nothing. On the other hand, wearing 3 shirts for more than 3 days makes people not want to come near you due to the stench.
Rather than shoot down things, why don’t you say how much time you’re willing to put into it and how much money? and what resources you have?
Ok. I’m unemployed, I have to spend my days helping my daughter with online schoolwork and I did buy new clothing this year because I’ve lost 60 pounds due to a still yet-to-be diagnosed illness where I haven’t eaten any solid food since August and dropping down that many sizes is not fixable by just altering pants. Let alone underwear.
Any more personal info you’d like? My telephone number? My bank balance?
No need to get snarky, you opened this convo by asking what you should wear and then just started lashing out. I am not responsible for your situation or the ludicrous injustice in the world, I am just trying to help.
I’m sorry you’re in a tough sitch, if you’re truly willing and able to do nothing then I have no idea why you asked. All I really say is wear second hand or get comfortable being a slaver, that’s the choice we get atm.
No need to get snarky, you opened this convo by asking what you should wear and then just started lashing out. I am not responsible for your situation or the ludicrous injustice in the world, I am just trying to help.
Unfortunately extremely high water usage to grow cotton, and a lot of it is grown in places that need that water for other things (RIP Aral Sea).
Based on the article we should use flax aka linen, which I suppose makes sense. Linen was once a finery due to the excessive effort needed to produce it, but now we have machinery.
Linen actually doesn’t take to large scale mechanization very well. It causes the fibers to break into shorter pieces more often, which makes the final fabric rougher and less sturdy. Machine-woven linen also tends to be more loosely woven, which is again less sturdy.
Machines certainly helped some amount, but cotton got a way bigger boost from industrialization. That’s why cotton is so much cheaper than linen today, especially high quality linen.
Reduce, reuse, recycle is the best bet. Most people in privileged areas own much more clothing than they need and dispose of it long before it’s worn out. Used clothing, hand me downs. Recycled plastic fibres (wash in one of those bags that filter out micro plastic). Plant fibres. Hemp is a great alternative to wool.
I’m looking up hemp clothing now. It’s just as expensive as the other option the other person gave me.
Purchasing used clothing, fine, but if your advice is to buy much more expensive clothing than I can afford, I guess I can’t wear the cruelty-free stuff if I need something new. And I’m sure as hell not buying used underwear.
Can’t say anything about buying new clothes, but as the budget’s tightened in my household I’ve been leaning how to mend my clothes. The ones I normally would’ve thrown away due to armpit/toe/crotch holes can be fixed somewhat easily.
One catch is that I use a sewing machine my MIL gave me - so there was some cost somewhere. But I see machines on craigslist going for sub 60 fairly often. The second catch is that I was lucky enough to develop an interest (and spend my free time) learning about how to mend clothes. If people lack free time/interest to learn how to do it, then they end up paying the new-clothes tax.
My wife does the sewing machine work here. I’m inept. But I’m okay with a needle and thread, so I’ve done plenty of my own (ugly) repairs. Some stuff it doesn’t matter on anyway, like fixing the toe in a sock. Easy to do and saves money on socks.
You’re basically telling me that in order to have cruelty-free wool, I have to be wealthy.
Congrats. You found out why there’s animal cruelty in the first place. People need cheaper things -> other things need to be sacrificed to make that happen.
Everyone can only do the best they can. Anyone who expects everyone to have zero impact is an idiot. Even a salad involved death and cruelty somewhere (animals caught in farm equipment, underpaid immigrant farmers who get abandoned if injured, etc).
So really, all you can do in your life if you care about these things is minimize your impact as much as you can based on what you know.
Similar to people who value giving to charity. Do they give all of their spare money to charity? No and no one should expect them to. Just giving anything to charity regularly has a positive impact and the whole “you’re not doing enough” does much more damage than good.
Reminds me of vegetarians/vegans. I’m not really either, but I don’t eat meat. And I’m just happy when I hear people say they want to eat less meat. Whereas most people who are against meat are only happy if someone else is also against it completely.
A better approach is probably to focus on clothes that last, and keep them longer. Of course those are also more expensive but it should even out over the long run
You could afford to, if companies were forced to go cruelty free. Clothing manufacturing is currently one of the most profitable industries, outpacing energy, fossil fuels, and technology industries while producing more new billionaires.
Do you really think that if they were forced to stop abusing animals, those companies would close shop and stop trying to sell textiles? That they would suddenly try to charge absurd prices for the same clothing you buy now?
Prices aren’t set by costs, they are set by what the market will beat. Profits are the difference between costs and what the market will bear. Clothing companies charge exactly as much as they can to generate the sales volume they want, and nothing less. They want to sell you cheap clothes.
This applies to every industry. Nestle would find a way to sell chocolate even if they were forced to stop using child slave labor.
Okay, and? What do you want us to do about it? Those companies are never willingly going to become cruelty free, and the government will never force them to while the bribery, I mean, lobbying continues.
The only way these companies will go cruelty free is if people totally stop buying non-cruelty free products, which again won’t happen because most people can’t afford cruelty free products.
Got it. People on this site are stupid idealistic as hell, so it’s probably good that I spelled out why these things are expensive. I wouldn’t be surprised if some folks thought animal cruelty exists in these industries because people are mean.
I buy very few clothes, so I save up to spend more on ones I think will last longer.
It’s very burdensome when something doesn’t last long enough to reach that price-equilibrium point compared to simply purchasing more, cheaper clothing.
I am currently almost out of socks and panties because of this :(
Yes, pretty much. You can’t verify mass produced, fast fashion clothes. If you want something realisticly certifiable you need to look for high quality, low volume products. Or get a personal tailor and shoemaker.
Can someone please tell me exactly what I’m supposed to be wearing?
Adopt actual sheep, and just strap them to your body for warmth.
So generally the entire clothes industry is slavery ridden and completely fucked. Trying to follow the supply chain is basically impossible.
I would suggest essentially as little as possible for as long as possible, plant fibres probs good. synthetic not really that bad given the whole state of everything it’s small fries in terms of plastic waste.
get local tailors to make clothing if you can afford it
Anyone who can afford that is not doing it to be sustainable and humanitarian and I think you know that.
Wtf are you talking about? I’m not super rich, but i get some things done with a local tailor and one of the biggest reasons is to support local business and avoid overseas slave labour
I look forward to Christmas every year so I can finally get new socks. You might not be super rich, but you’re certainly not poor, either.
You really don’t know what choices someone is making. If you replace clothing about once a decade and don’t own much it’s not very expensive.
High up front sure but maybe someone is eating cheap bean and rice based food, maybe they don’t buy alcohol, maybe they don’t own a car, maybe they buy used stuff rather than new whatever. There are loads of ways for many people to squirrel away the funds to get an item made here and there. Yeah obvs if you’re destitute it’s impossible and right now with economies going to shit way more people are losing money each week but prior there were choices people could usually make.
Yes it involves giving up other things and it can be stressful and difficult but that’s expected. Slavery makes things cheap in dollars and high in human misery.
“Some things.” So not all of your clothes. In other words, you also can’t afford to wear all cruelty-free clothing.
That really is a ‘where you live’ thing. When I lived in SEA I could buy a button down shirt you could wear to work for about $5, going to a tailor and having one bespoke was $6 in cotton, or $15 in silk. Wool was actually more expensive since there was no domestic production.
Does SEA mean Seattle or South East Asia?
Sorry, southeast Asia
Depends on where you live. In European cities it will be expensive to get new things tailored, but there will be shops only for changes and repairs, which will be cheaper, for example.
Yes, but we’re talking about buying clothes, not getting them repaired.
That really depends. If you buy a tshirt it was probably made paying someone like 5c a day.
If you find someone who makes clothing, just a normal arse person not someone catering to the rich, they can probably make a basic tshirt to your rough size in about 3 hours or so. If they’re paid a reasonable fee that’s going to be in my country for example 200 aud or so factoring in material. A sweat shop T would be 20 to 50, or even 80 in a high end store so it’s really not much more expensive.
Wear it till it has holes in it so say 5 to 10 years and it’s really not that expensive.
More complicated clothing gets more expensive but a basic wardrobe is something like 3 Ts, 3 long sleave tops, 2 heavy pants, 2 light pants/skirts etc. you don’t need to buy it all at once. Sometimes you need more clothes than that, e.g. you’re a woman and you work customer facing but most people have waaaaay more clothes than they need.
No, you just have to do laundry more than once a week. Most people who don’t have their own washer or dryer don’t have time for that.
What are you doing where you can’t wear pants for a week or a top for 3 days?
Hard labour you don’t wear new clothes you wear your old tattered stuff and hand me downs/second hand etc, or toughened workwear.
It sounds like you want to find a reason to do nothing rather than do what you can. Like if you want to avoid enslaving others and animal cruelty your lifestyle will have to change because your lifestyle is based on exploitation. If you don’t want to change then get comfortable with slavery, idk what else to say.
Rather than shoot down things, why don’t you say how much time you’re willing to put into it and how much money? and what resources you have?
Nothing. On the other hand, wearing 3 shirts for more than 3 days makes people not want to come near you due to the stench.
Ok. I’m unemployed, I have to spend my days helping my daughter with online schoolwork and I did buy new clothing this year because I’ve lost 60 pounds due to a still yet-to-be diagnosed illness where I haven’t eaten any solid food since August and dropping down that many sizes is not fixable by just altering pants. Let alone underwear.
Any more personal info you’d like? My telephone number? My bank balance?
No need to get snarky, you opened this convo by asking what you should wear and then just started lashing out. I am not responsible for your situation or the ludicrous injustice in the world, I am just trying to help.
I’m sorry you’re in a tough sitch, if you’re truly willing and able to do nothing then I have no idea why you asked. All I really say is wear second hand or get comfortable being a slaver, that’s the choice we get atm.
I never said you were. You asked, so I told you.
Simplest answer: cotton. It’s cheap and good enough for most uses. High-grade cotton like Supima is extra comfortable and not much more expensive.
It’s not very good for the use of keeping you warm. Unlike wool.
Unfortunately extremely high water usage to grow cotton, and a lot of it is grown in places that need that water for other things (RIP Aral Sea).
Based on the article we should use flax aka linen, which I suppose makes sense. Linen was once a finery due to the excessive effort needed to produce it, but now we have machinery.
Linen actually doesn’t take to large scale mechanization very well. It causes the fibers to break into shorter pieces more often, which makes the final fabric rougher and less sturdy. Machine-woven linen also tends to be more loosely woven, which is again less sturdy.
Machines certainly helped some amount, but cotton got a way bigger boost from industrialization. That’s why cotton is so much cheaper than linen today, especially high quality linen.
Nothing! Go forth and let it all be free and flap around!
Reduce, reuse, recycle is the best bet. Most people in privileged areas own much more clothing than they need and dispose of it long before it’s worn out. Used clothing, hand me downs. Recycled plastic fibres (wash in one of those bags that filter out micro plastic). Plant fibres. Hemp is a great alternative to wool.
I’m looking up hemp clothing now. It’s just as expensive as the other option the other person gave me.
Purchasing used clothing, fine, but if your advice is to buy much more expensive clothing than I can afford, I guess I can’t wear the cruelty-free stuff if I need something new. And I’m sure as hell not buying used underwear.
Can’t say anything about buying new clothes, but as the budget’s tightened in my household I’ve been leaning how to mend my clothes. The ones I normally would’ve thrown away due to armpit/toe/crotch holes can be fixed somewhat easily.
One catch is that I use a sewing machine my MIL gave me - so there was some cost somewhere. But I see machines on craigslist going for sub 60 fairly often. The second catch is that I was lucky enough to develop an interest (and spend my free time) learning about how to mend clothes. If people lack free time/interest to learn how to do it, then they end up paying the new-clothes tax.
My wife does the sewing machine work here. I’m inept. But I’m okay with a needle and thread, so I’ve done plenty of my own (ugly) repairs. Some stuff it doesn’t matter on anyway, like fixing the toe in a sock. Easy to do and saves money on socks.
I’ve got a hole in my sock! Darn it!
Based on the news today, human skin™️ apparently
If we change the climate enough via global warming we can make it so it’s always hot then we will no longer need clothes!
There are mulesing free certificates, and some companies go the extra mile.
Varusteleka is pretty open about their wool, but they don’t have the biggest selection.
(varusteleka, I’ve called you out twice on this account, sponsor me lmao)
Are you fucking kidding me?
Do you think most people can buy clothes for that kind of money? I sure as fuck can’t afford a shirt that costs $64 or pants that cost $160.
You’re basically telling me that in order to have cruelty-free wool, I have to be wealthy.
Congrats. You found out why there’s animal cruelty in the first place. People need cheaper things -> other things need to be sacrificed to make that happen.
That was my point. People who expect me to go cruelty-free think I can afford to.
Everyone can only do the best they can. Anyone who expects everyone to have zero impact is an idiot. Even a salad involved death and cruelty somewhere (animals caught in farm equipment, underpaid immigrant farmers who get abandoned if injured, etc).
So really, all you can do in your life if you care about these things is minimize your impact as much as you can based on what you know.
Similar to people who value giving to charity. Do they give all of their spare money to charity? No and no one should expect them to. Just giving anything to charity regularly has a positive impact and the whole “you’re not doing enough” does much more damage than good.
Reminds me of vegetarians/vegans. I’m not really either, but I don’t eat meat. And I’m just happy when I hear people say they want to eat less meat. Whereas most people who are against meat are only happy if someone else is also against it completely.
A better approach is probably to focus on clothes that last, and keep them longer. Of course those are also more expensive but it should even out over the long run
You could afford to, if companies were forced to go cruelty free. Clothing manufacturing is currently one of the most profitable industries, outpacing energy, fossil fuels, and technology industries while producing more new billionaires.
Do you really think that if they were forced to stop abusing animals, those companies would close shop and stop trying to sell textiles? That they would suddenly try to charge absurd prices for the same clothing you buy now?
Prices aren’t set by costs, they are set by what the market will beat. Profits are the difference between costs and what the market will bear. Clothing companies charge exactly as much as they can to generate the sales volume they want, and nothing less. They want to sell you cheap clothes.
This applies to every industry. Nestle would find a way to sell chocolate even if they were forced to stop using child slave labor.
Okay, and? What do you want us to do about it? Those companies are never willingly going to become cruelty free, and the government will never force them to while the
bribery, I mean, lobbying continues.The only way these companies will go cruelty free is if people totally stop buying non-cruelty free products, which again won’t happen because most people can’t afford cruelty free products.
Got it. People on this site are
stupididealistic as hell, so it’s probably good that I spelled out why these things are expensive. I wouldn’t be surprised if some folks thought animal cruelty exists in these industries because people are mean.That is correct.
Ethics come at a premium. Ethics are a luxury good.
But that was my point. I can’t afford luxury goods. Most people can’t. So we have no choice in wearing clothes made with cruelty.
I agree with you wholeheartedly.
I buy very few clothes, so I save up to spend more on ones I think will last longer.
It’s very burdensome when something doesn’t last long enough to reach that price-equilibrium point compared to simply purchasing more, cheaper clothing.
I am currently almost out of socks and panties because of this :(
Yes, pretty much. You can’t verify mass produced, fast fashion clothes. If you want something realisticly certifiable you need to look for high quality, low volume products. Or get a personal tailor and shoemaker.
As little as possible.